Skip to content
  • About
  • Contact
  • Contribute
  • My Book
  • Careers
  • Podcast
  • Transcripts
  • Speaking
KevinMD
  • All
  • Physician
  • Burnout
  • Practice
  • Policy
  • Finance
  • Conditions
  • .edu
  • Patient
  • Meds
  • Tech
  • Social
  • All
  • Physician
  • Burnout
  • Practice
  • Policy
  • Finance
  • Conditions
  • .edu
  • Patient
  • Meds
  • Tech
  • Social
    • All
    • Physician
    • Burnout
    • Practice
    • Policy
    • Finance
    • Conditions
    • .edu
    • Patient
    • Meds
    • Tech
    • Social
    • About
    • Contact
    • Contribute
    • My Book
    • Careers
    • Podcast
    • Transcripts
    • Speaking
KevinMD
  • All
  • Physician
  • Burnout
  • Practice
  • Policy
  • Finance
  • Conditions
  • .edu
  • Patient
  • Meds
  • Tech
  • Social
    • All
    • Physician
    • Burnout
    • Practice
    • Policy
    • Finance
    • Conditions
    • .edu
    • Patient
    • Meds
    • Tech
    • Social
    • About
    • Contact
    • Contribute
    • My Book
    • Careers
    • Podcast
    • Transcripts
    • Speaking
  • About Kevin Pho, MD, Founder of KevinMD
  • Be heard on social media’s leading physician voice
  • Contact Kevin
  • Custom enhanced author page pricing
  • DMCA Policy
  • Establishing, Managing, and Protecting Your Online Reputation: A Social Media Guide for Physicians and Medical Practices
  • KevinMD influencer opportunities
  • Opinion and commentary by KevinMD
  • Physician burnout speakers to keynote your conference
  • Physician Coaching by KevinMD
  • Physician keynote speaker: Kevin Pho, MD
  • Physician Speaking by KevinMD: a boutique speakers bureau
  • Primary care physician in Nashua, NH | Kevin Pho, MD
  • Privacy Policy
  • Recommended services by KevinMD
  • Terms of Use Agreement
  • Thank you for subscribing to KevinMD
  • Thank you for upgrading to the KevinMD enhanced author page
  • Upgrade to the KevinMD enhanced author page

Billing for end of life conversations needs to be an honest discussion

Shirie Leng, MD
Physician
September 5, 2013
Share
Tweet
Share

Good old Earl Blumenauer.  A bespectacled and bowtied Congressman from Oregon.  He of the “death panel” proposal.  Thank God he’s still here.  Presuming that the crazy talk over the provision in the Affordable Care Act that would have paid doctors to discuss end-of-life issues with patients is over, he has introduced a separate bill with this provision and hopes to get it passed in the next couple of years.

What Congressman Blumenauer is proposing is really to validate conversation by providing it with a monetary value.   Everything that is valued in medicine has a monetary value.  In anesthesia the value of time is monetized in increments of 15 minutes.  There is no more relevant data in the electronic medical record than the start and end times.  Multiple emails go out daily from our two full-time coding folks if the start time of one case overlaps with the end time of another.   Not because they want the times to be accurate.  Because they want to bill.  You can’t bill for curbsides.  You don’t bill for answering the phone.  You don’t get money for answering patient email.  Communication is not valued, in the sense that it is not assigned a monetary value.  Thus, it doesn’t happen.   If this bill, provided it passes, is going to provide legitimacy and value to having an honest conversation within the context of medicine, I’m all for it.

That’s as long as it is an honest conversation.  Paying people to do something produces far different results than people doing the thing because it’s the right thing to do.  I pay my cleaning lady to clean my house.  She only cleans my house because I pay her.  The more houses she cleans, the more she gets paid.  So her focus is on how quickly can she clean my house, not necessarily on how well  she can clean the parts of my house that matter, like the kids’s bathroom or the kitchen.

I could clean my house, without pay, because it needs to be clean.  I won’t do it quickly (or with much grace) but I will focus on the parts of the house that matter the most to me.  Same with advance directive conversations.  As a doctor, I can observe that this particular patient needs to have this conversation, and because I see the need I do it, focusing on the parts that are of most concern to this particular patient.  If I’m paid to have this conversation, or it becomes attached to rewards and penalties, I may be tempted to develop a template or routine that prompts me to cover everything I need to cover and ask all the questions on the list but not the ones the patient necessarily cares about.

Because once you can bill for something, someone can start requiring it, measuring it, and regulating it. Once you can bill for something, it quickly becomes another check box on someone’s computer program and usually ends up on an ever-increasing pile of quality measures.  Once it be becomes a quality measure, it starts getting tied to performance reviews, rewards and penalties, and yes, money.  I sincerely hope this doesn’t happen, but the trends do not bode well.  If the bill passes.  The trends don’t bode well for this either.

Shirie Leng is an anesthesiologist who blogs at medicine for real.

Prev

The primary care crisis has been legislated

September 5, 2013 Kevin 15
…
Next

Does the process of diseasification hold any promise in obesity?

September 5, 2013 Kevin 18
…

Tagged as: Palliative Care

< Previous Post
The primary care crisis has been legislated
Next Post >
Does the process of diseasification hold any promise in obesity?

ADVERTISEMENT

More by Shirie Leng, MD

  • The choice between medicine and nursing

    Shirie Leng, MD
  • New technology might help us become more empathetic to others’ suffering

    Shirie Leng, MD
  • Does practice really make perfect?

    Shirie Leng, MD

More in Physician

  • Medical hierarchy is silencing young doctors who want to write

    Dr. Buga Charles George Kenyi
  • Why military patients carry pain a chart can’t explain

    Ann Lebeck, MD
  • Leaving medicine is a translation problem, not a loss

    Shveta Gupta, MD, MBA
  • When a divorce ends a physician’s career

    Donald J. Murphy, MD
  • Military sports medicine and the cost of readiness

    Ann Lebeck, MD
  • When medicine confuses professionalism vs. compliance

    Gus W. Krucke, MD
  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • DEA fear is reshaping how doctors prescribe

      Ronald L. Lindsay, MD | Physician
    • Violence against doctors: 5 forces that ignite it

      Timothy Lesaca, MD | Physician
    • The double standard at the heart of chronic pain treatment

      Joshua Saylor | Conditions and Diseases
    • Your sinus infection may not be an infection

      Franklyn R. Gergits, DO, MBA | Conditions and Diseases
    • Why does post-discharge care keep breaking down?

      Katherine Owen, RN | Conditions and Diseases
    • Physicians must shape AI in medicine, not watch it

      Sonal Patel, MD | Health Technology
  • Past 6 Months

    • Primary care crisis requires new training and skills

      Justin Oldfield, MD | Physician
    • Polycystic ovary syndrome is more than ovarian

      Oluyemisi Famuyiwa, MD | Conditions and Diseases
    • DEA fear is reshaping how doctors prescribe

      Ronald L. Lindsay, MD | Physician
    • Expanding the SOAP framework boosts health outcomes

      Deepak Gupta, MD and Sarwan Kumar, MD | Physician
    • The handwashing standard nobody finished. Until now.

      Bernadette Burroughs, RN | Conditions and Diseases
    • Primary care access is the real problem, not the system

      Payam Zamani, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • Medical hierarchy is silencing young doctors who want to write

      Dr. Buga Charles George Kenyi | Physician
    • Is anticoagulation bleeding risk worse in the real world?

      David K. Cundiff, MD | Medications
    • 5 layers every dengue prevention plan now needs

      Melvin Sanicas, MD | Conditions and Diseases
    • How administrative costs are crushing physician practices

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician Finance
    • Fragmented care is the gap digital health left open

      Robert Nieves, JD, MBA, MPA, RN | Health Policy
    • Musculoskeletal health may be the foundation of prevention

      Narinder Singh Parhar, MD | Conditions and Diseases

Subscribe to KevinMD and never miss a story!

Get free updates delivered free to your inbox.


Find jobs at
Careers by KevinMD.com

Search thousands of physician, PA, NP, and CRNA jobs now.

Learn more

View 15 Comments >

Founded in 2004 by Kevin Pho, MD, KevinMD.com is the web’s leading platform where physicians, advanced practitioners, nurses, medical students, and patients share their insight and tell their stories.

Social

  • Like on Facebook
  • Follow on Twitter
  • Connect on Linkedin
  • Subscribe on Youtube
  • Instagram

ADVERTISEMENT

  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • DEA fear is reshaping how doctors prescribe

      Ronald L. Lindsay, MD | Physician
    • Violence against doctors: 5 forces that ignite it

      Timothy Lesaca, MD | Physician
    • The double standard at the heart of chronic pain treatment

      Joshua Saylor | Conditions and Diseases
    • Your sinus infection may not be an infection

      Franklyn R. Gergits, DO, MBA | Conditions and Diseases
    • Why does post-discharge care keep breaking down?

      Katherine Owen, RN | Conditions and Diseases
    • Physicians must shape AI in medicine, not watch it

      Sonal Patel, MD | Health Technology
  • Past 6 Months

    • Primary care crisis requires new training and skills

      Justin Oldfield, MD | Physician
    • Polycystic ovary syndrome is more than ovarian

      Oluyemisi Famuyiwa, MD | Conditions and Diseases
    • DEA fear is reshaping how doctors prescribe

      Ronald L. Lindsay, MD | Physician
    • Expanding the SOAP framework boosts health outcomes

      Deepak Gupta, MD and Sarwan Kumar, MD | Physician
    • The handwashing standard nobody finished. Until now.

      Bernadette Burroughs, RN | Conditions and Diseases
    • Primary care access is the real problem, not the system

      Payam Zamani, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • Medical hierarchy is silencing young doctors who want to write

      Dr. Buga Charles George Kenyi | Physician
    • Is anticoagulation bleeding risk worse in the real world?

      David K. Cundiff, MD | Medications
    • 5 layers every dengue prevention plan now needs

      Melvin Sanicas, MD | Conditions and Diseases
    • How administrative costs are crushing physician practices

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician Finance
    • Fragmented care is the gap digital health left open

      Robert Nieves, JD, MBA, MPA, RN | Health Policy
    • Musculoskeletal health may be the foundation of prevention

      Narinder Singh Parhar, MD | Conditions and Diseases

MedPage Today Professional

An Everyday Health Property Medpage Today

Copyright © 2026 KevinMD.com | Powered by Astra WordPress Theme

  • Terms of Use | Disclaimer
  • Privacy Policy
  • DMCA Policy
All Content © KevinMD, LLC
Site by Outthink Group

Billing for end of life conversations needs to be an honest discussion
15 comments

Comments are moderated before they are published. Please read the comment policy.

Loading Comments...