Skip to content
  • About
  • Contact
  • Contribute
  • Book
  • Careers
  • Podcast
  • Recommended
  • Speaking
  • All
  • Physician
  • Practice
  • Policy
  • Finance
  • Conditions
  • .edu
  • Patient
  • Meds
  • Tech
  • Social
  • Video
    • All
    • Physician
    • Practice
    • Policy
    • Finance
    • Conditions
    • .edu
    • Patient
    • Meds
    • Tech
    • Social
    • Video
    • About
    • Contact
    • Contribute
    • Book
    • Careers
    • Podcast
    • Recommended
    • Speaking

Medical school and medical training in Ireland

Vineet Arora, MD
Education
December 17, 2010
Share
Tweet
Share

I recently spent a week in Ireland, taking in the sights and spirits.

I was actually there for work too – visiting the University College of Dublin and the Mater Miserecordia Hospital – or the original Mercy Hospital as they refer to it.   As the future of primary care, residency work hours, and the healthcare insurance system continue to cause angst in the US, we often find ourselves referencing what our European colleagues do.  Well, there’s nothing like asking the people and observing for yourself.  For example, the first time I heard the word “bleep”, I thought they were politely avoiding colorful language in front of me.  But in fact, to page someone is to bleep them and you’re always afraid your bleeper will go off.

While this is a small difference, there are quite a few substantial differences in their medical education system.

  • Residency work hours? I was expecting that the European Working Time Directive was in effect, where all workers are to work only a maximum of 48 hours.  What I learned is that each country has determined its own ‘solution’ and really ‘style’ in managing this constraint.  In Ireland, to preserve some aspect of continuity, they have in effect argued for dividing educational hours from ‘service hours.’  Therefore, all junior doctors can work 48 hours of ‘service’ and have an additional 12 hours of ‘education’ for a total of 60 hours per week.  The residents do still have a culture of staying until the work is done.  But, they are on the cusp of change since this years interns are now limited to 24hour shift maximums creating some concern that they will not have the same experience and learning as the seniors before them got.
  • Supervision? The team model of inpatient care was in full effect but with slightly shuffled roles.  Interns did mostly cross cover for large numbers of patients.  Admitting was done predominantly by residents (aka Senior House Officers or SHO).  Also in house is a registrar, who is a physician who has completed at least 3 years of post graduate training and is available for supervision for the intern and senior house officer and is spending another 4 to 6 years in training in a clinical subspecialty at this level.  Consultants (aka attendings) come by for rounds less frequently since the registrar is quite capable having in fact completed their training.
  • Cost of medical school? Indeed, medical school in Ireland is free for EU citizens, but only if you continue to pass so there is a strong incentive to pass.  Entry into medical school can be from high school but also can occur as a graduate of the college.  In fact, there is quite a diverse generation of students that are all in training together simultaneously.  Moreover, the tuition from foreign students (non EU that is) is what the medical schools thrive on, which was similar to my experience in China.  The foreign students come from all over, but quite a few come from Malaysia.
  • Access to care? While healthcare disparities are not focused as much on race as they are on income.  Those that are rich are able to buy private insurance and ‘jump the cue’ so to speak to get a consultation with a specialist.  If you don’t have private insurance, you’re relegated to the public insurance system where it could take several months at least to see a rheumatologist or orthopedic surgeon.   Seeing a general practitioner (primary care doctor) also costs quite a bit of money so people don’t visit the doctor unless they have to.  Interestingly, in Northern Ireland, which is still under British rule, citizens can see their GP for free.  In certain rural areas of Ireland, Gaelic may be exclusively spoken by patients so doctors in those areas need to have a strong command of the native language of Ireland.
  • Competitive specialties? While I explained to my colleagues what the ROAD was, they speculated it would be the O’s for them– Opthalmology, Orthopedics and OB/GYN.  While the first 2 are understandable, I had to ask about OB.  Obstetric care is insured in Ireland guaranteeing a decent salary (they also don’t face the high malpractice premiums). Also, primary care is not devalued since Irish docs actually enjoy becoming GP’s since they get more autonomy and entry into specialty training is heavily restricted by the number of positions and is tied to the hospital limiting jobs, since a ‘consultant’ post at a hospital may or may not be available upon completion of specialty training.  Workforce planning seemed to be a hot topic while I was there, as there were commissions that were deciding the future of the numbers of training posts in Ireland.

Thanks especially to all my wonderful hosts at the University College of Dublin and Mater Misericordia Hospital for their generous hospitality and putting up with all my questions!

Vineet Arora is an internal medicine physician who blogs at FutureDocs.

Submit a guest post and be heard.

Prev

The art of medicine and mastering relationships

December 17, 2010 Kevin 8
…
Next

Giving children probiotics

December 18, 2010 Kevin 5
…

Tagged as: Medical school, Residency

Post navigation

< Previous Post
The art of medicine and mastering relationships
Next Post >
Giving children probiotics

ADVERTISEMENT

More by Vineet Arora, MD

  • Physicians: Use your voice to make the difference

    Vineet Arora, MD
  • a desk with keyboard and ipad with the kevinmd logo

    The broken window theory in health: Examples of graffiti we can fix

    Vineet Arora, MD
  • a desk with keyboard and ipad with the kevinmd logo

    The July effect: Welcome to the summer of supervision

    Vineet Arora, MD

More in Education

  • My first week on night float as a medical student

    Amish Jain
  • Why doctors need emotional literacy training

    Vineet Vishwanath
  • A simple 10-10-10 tool to prevent burnout through mindfulness

    Annabelle Bailey
  • How racism and policy failures shape reproductive health in America

    Kaitlynn Esemaya, Alexis Thompson, Annique McLune, and Anamaria Ancheta
  • Imagining a career path beyond medicine and its impact

    Hunter Delmoe
  • What is professional identity formation in medicine?

    Adrian Reynolds, PhD
  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • Why doctors must fight for a just health care system

      Alankrita Olson, MD, MPH & Ashley Duhon, MD & Toby Terwilliger, MD | Policy
    • The human case for preserving the nipple after mastectomy

      Thomas Amburn, MD | Conditions
    • IMGs are the future of U.S. primary care

      Adam Brandon Bondoc, MD | Physician
    • How transplant recipients can pay it forward through organ donation

      Deepak Gupta, MD | Physician
    • Women physicians: How can they survive and thrive in academic medicine?

      Elina Maymind, MD | Physician
    • Why AI in health care needs stronger testing before clinical use [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast
  • Past 6 Months

    • Health equity in Inland Southern California requires urgent action

      Vishruth Nagam | Policy
    • How restrictive opioid policies worsen the crisis

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician
    • Why primary care needs better dermatology training

      Alex Siauw | Conditions
    • Why pain doctors face unfair scrutiny and harsh penalties in California

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician
    • How hospitals can prepare for CMS’s new patient safety rule

      Kim Adelman, PhD | Conditions
    • Why physician strikes are a form of hospice

      Patrick Hudson, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • How to transform your mindset by rewiring your brain with positive language [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast
    • What is a varicocele and how does it affect fertility?

      Martina Ambardjieva, MD, PhD | Conditions
    • How profit-driven hospitals fail long-term patient care

      John Corsino, DPT | Conditions
    • Complicity vs. protest: a doctor’s choice

      Patrick Hudson, MD | Physician
    • How physician burnout and system reform are shaping the future of U.S. health care

      Irim Salik, MD | Policy
    • How nature is inspiring the future of pain medicine

      Varun Mangal | Conditions

Subscribe to KevinMD and never miss a story!

Get free updates delivered free to your inbox.


Find jobs at
Careers by KevinMD.com

Search thousands of physician, PA, NP, and CRNA jobs now.

Learn more

View 10 Comments >

Founded in 2004 by Kevin Pho, MD, KevinMD.com is the web’s leading platform where physicians, advanced practitioners, nurses, medical students, and patients share their insight and tell their stories.

Social

  • Like on Facebook
  • Follow on Twitter
  • Connect on Linkedin
  • Subscribe on Youtube
  • Instagram

ADVERTISEMENT

ADVERTISEMENT

  • Most Popular

  • Past Week

    • Why doctors must fight for a just health care system

      Alankrita Olson, MD, MPH & Ashley Duhon, MD & Toby Terwilliger, MD | Policy
    • The human case for preserving the nipple after mastectomy

      Thomas Amburn, MD | Conditions
    • IMGs are the future of U.S. primary care

      Adam Brandon Bondoc, MD | Physician
    • How transplant recipients can pay it forward through organ donation

      Deepak Gupta, MD | Physician
    • Women physicians: How can they survive and thrive in academic medicine?

      Elina Maymind, MD | Physician
    • Why AI in health care needs stronger testing before clinical use [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast
  • Past 6 Months

    • Health equity in Inland Southern California requires urgent action

      Vishruth Nagam | Policy
    • How restrictive opioid policies worsen the crisis

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician
    • Why primary care needs better dermatology training

      Alex Siauw | Conditions
    • Why pain doctors face unfair scrutiny and harsh penalties in California

      Kayvan Haddadan, MD | Physician
    • How hospitals can prepare for CMS’s new patient safety rule

      Kim Adelman, PhD | Conditions
    • Why physician strikes are a form of hospice

      Patrick Hudson, MD | Physician
  • Recent Posts

    • How to transform your mindset by rewiring your brain with positive language [PODCAST]

      The Podcast by KevinMD | Podcast
    • What is a varicocele and how does it affect fertility?

      Martina Ambardjieva, MD, PhD | Conditions
    • How profit-driven hospitals fail long-term patient care

      John Corsino, DPT | Conditions
    • Complicity vs. protest: a doctor’s choice

      Patrick Hudson, MD | Physician
    • How physician burnout and system reform are shaping the future of U.S. health care

      Irim Salik, MD | Policy
    • How nature is inspiring the future of pain medicine

      Varun Mangal | Conditions

MedPage Today Professional

An Everyday Health Property Medpage Today
  • Terms of Use | Disclaimer
  • Privacy Policy
  • DMCA Policy
All Content © KevinMD, LLC
Site by Outthink Group

Medical school and medical training in Ireland
10 comments

Comments are moderated before they are published. Please read the comment policy.

Loading Comments...