An infectious disease physician says: Wear a F-ing mask [PODCAST]

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“In honor of one of the great classic novels, Go the F**k to Sleep, I would like to present to you my literary work: Stay the F@$k at Home.

To the healthy 20 year old who asks, “Why should I stay the F@$k at home, COVID-19 is not going to kill me?”

I ask: Do you want to kill your nana and grand-pops?

No?

Then stay the F@$k at home.”

Jesica Herrick is an infectious disease physician.

She shares her story and discusses her KevinMD article, “An infectious disease physician says: Stay the F@$k at home.”

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Hosted by Kevin Pho, MD, The Podcast by KevinMD shares the stories of the many who intersect with our health care system but are rarely heard from.

Transcript

Kevin Pho: Hi, and welcome to the show, where we share the stories of the many who intersect with our health care system but are rarely heard from. My name is Kevin Pho, founder and editor of KevinMD. Today on the show we have Jesica Herrick. She’s an infectious disease physician, and she wrote the KevinMD article “An infectious disease physician says: Stay the F@$k at home,” and you can use your imagination as to what the F stands for. Jesica, welcome to the show.

Jesica Herrick: Thank you for having me, very much.

Kevin Pho: So we’re going to do the article in a little bit, but first off, can you share your story and your journey to where you are today?

Jesica Herrick: Sure. So I am an infectious disease physician, as you just said. I did medical school at University of Nebraska, residency at University of Illinois, and then fellowship at NIH, where I trained under Dr. Fauci, for one, and then came back to UIC to be an ID physician a couple years ago. I actually normally study tropical medicine and parasites, but as is the case with, I think, most physicians, we’re all kind of dealing with COVID and not a ton else in the last six months or so.

Kevin Pho: So we’re now speaking in the third week of August. Tell me what you’re seeing in the community from an infectious disease standpoint.

Jesica Herrick: We had really gone down, and I think in the last month or so our cases have started to go up. And I will say, I live near Chicago, and I think our mayor and governor have just done a fantastic job, and I think it could be a lot worse. But we have seen that our cases got as low as 400 a day maybe a month or six weeks ago, and now we’re seeing about 2,000 a day.

Kevin Pho: And how close are we to a vaccine? You see Russia, for instance, they’re producing a vaccine, and various options, they claim, are in phase 3 trials, right? Some say that we’re getting it by early 2021; some say it’s later on. So from, again, an infectious disease standpoint, what is accurate information in terms of where we stand with vaccines?

Jesica Herrick: Yeah, so definitely you are not the first person to ask me that. Whenever people ask me, or especially my family, my parents are asking me that question all the time, and my answer is always: Listen to what Tony Fauci is saying. There’s a lot of hope that we will have a vaccine soon. What soon means, I don’t know. It could be as early as January; it could be more like the middle of next year. But I think definitely we are going to have a vaccine. We’re all hoping that it will be as soon as we can get it.

Kevin Pho: And what are some of the challenges that vaccine makers are facing, especially on such an expedited timeline?

Jesica Herrick: So I actually think that, yes, the timeline is expedited, but I think that in a way it’s not as challenging as you would think. I think all of the resources that we can are being put toward us, and I think it’s really kind of an example of what we can accomplish when we make things a priority. So I mean, when you think about the history of vaccines and how difficult they are to make, and then you think that within about a year we’ll have a vaccine for this brand-new virus that we’ve never seen before, I think that is sort of a thing.

I mean, I’ve seen studies that say that up to 30, and maybe even higher, percent of people are already saying that they’re not going to take a COVID vaccine, and so I think that’s concerning.

Kevin Pho: Public health messaging has been an issue, and what you said about convincing people to take the vaccine really plays right into that right now. One of the things that Dr. Fauci excels at is really his health care communication and his public health communication.

Jesica Herrick: Yes, he’s wonderful in terms of how he comes across on television. He’s very honest, and he’s

Kevin Pho: I’m a primary care physician, and you’re an infectious disease physician. Now, what are some techniques that we can use to help overcome the opposition to public health messaging?

Jesica Herrick: Oh, man, if I had the answer to that, I would be able to make the world a much better place. I mean, I think all you can do is do what Tony Fauci does, which is to just be honest with people and set realistic expectations. And I think part of it is the world is so complicated, and people are so busy, and this is an extremely complicated topic, and so I think there’s some confusion that doesn’t need to be there. Like, I’m sure you’ve heard people say, “Well, first you told me not to wear a mask, now you’re saying wear a mask, so what am I supposed to believe?”

And I think really the way to sort of fix that is just good communication. Well, yes, initially they said don’t wear a mask because we were worried about our mask supplies, not because we didn’t think that masks prevent the spread of disease, right? And we didn’t know how widespread it was in the community. So I think the more you can be like Fauci, and be honest and open and completely upfront in communicating with people, I think the better. You know, I think what we’ve seen is if people trust you, they’re more likely to hear your message. So people trust Fauci, and I think that’s why his messaging is so powerful.

Kevin Pho: Maybe we need a bumper sticker: “Be like Fauci.”

Jesica Herrick: I know. I should start that. That would be a business there.

Kevin Pho: So one of the things that clouds public health messaging is the amount of misinformation that’s out there, especially perpetuated by social media. And specifically, again, what are some things that we can do to mitigate that?

Jesica Herrick: So it’s very hard, because I think part of the problem is that people look for evidence that fits what they already believe. So if you already believe that the virus is a hoax, then you can find something on Facebook that says that. If you believe that the virus is real, you’ll find, obviously, lots of things on Facebook that confirm that bias as well. I mean, it’s such a tricky thing. I don’t know if there’s really an easy answer.

I think the more we can turn people into sort of critical thinkers and critical readers of social media, probably the better. Just because you see one thing on social media obviously doesn’t make it true, and you have to sort of think about the source, the potential biases of the source, and whether other sources back that up or don’t. I mean, I think this is something that has become really important in sort of our modern world, and I’m sure there are people whose entire careers are focused on trying to solve these issues and address this really pandemic of misinformation that’s been going around.

Kevin Pho: So let’s now talk about your KevinMD article, “An infectious disease physician says: Stay the F@$k at home.” Now, for those who haven’t read it, can you share the story behind why you wrote it?

Jesica Herrick: As you can probably imagine by the fact that that was my article, I have a child. So I have a four-year-old, and like many people who have children, I’ve read the book “Go the F to Sleep,” which I think was narrated by Samuel Jackson, and it’s all about a lullaby to your child that lovingly says, “Please go the F to sleep.”

So, yeah, I guess this was relatively early in the pandemic. I think it was in March, late March or something, and that phrase kept kind of sticking in my head. And this was long before mask mandates or anything like that, as the pandemic was just first taking off, and I think the message we were trying to get out there was, if you don’t need to go out in public, don’t go out in public. And this was hard, but we really cut back on even going to the grocery store. So we would normally go to the grocery store and to Costco every week and stuff like that, and we really started backing down on that.

I think sometimes if you say it in a funny way, that has more impact than if you say it in sort of a dry way. So it’s like people who watch The Daily Show or something like that are more educated about news stories. So I thought if you say it in a sort of memorable and funny way, then that message might penetrate a little bit more than sort of a dry scientific recitation of data.

Kevin Pho: No, I agree with that. I think the variety of your messaging, I think that is one way to certainly help combat the misinformation, especially on social media. Last week, Joe Biden, the Democratic nominee for president, wanted a national mask mandate. Now, what are your thoughts on that, and do you think something like that will be effective?

Jesica Herrick: Yeah, so I think there’s no doubt that it would be effective, and I think that would be a great thing. I mean, whenever I talk to family members about this, I keep going back to an interview I saw with Tom Hanks. He was talking about his experience with COVID, and he said, “You know how people talk about, ‘Oh, it’s the least you can do’? This is literally the least you can do.” I for the life of me do not understand how this has become controversial. As doctors, especially before you go to med school, you have this sort of hero dream that you’re going to be this big lifesaver. All you have to do is literally put something over your face to potentially save a life. I cannot imagine why anyone would not do that. I truly do not understand.

I think about my mom. She was actually a bone marrow donor, and, my mom’s adorable, but she was so excited to be a bone marrow donor, and she was so thrilled and touched that she got to help somebody in that way. And you think about what she had to do: She had to take medications, she had to undergo potentially painful tests, and she was willing to do that to potentially help someone. All we’re asking people to do is wear a piece of cloth over their face. It’s mind-boggling to me that there would be any sort of controversy.

Kevin Pho: We’re talking to Jesica Herrick. She’s an infectious disease physician, and she wrote the KevinMD article “An infectious disease physician says: Stay the F@$k at home.” Jesica, is there something that you’ve learned over the last few months that you know now that you wish you knew back before the pandemic started?

Jesica Herrick: If I kind of want to go negative, I’ll say that I was not prepared, and I was very surprised at how things that people who really understand medicine and understand what’s going on understand to be truth, people not in the medical field, with no experience, no real background in the field, can deny as being true.

The other one, if I’m going to go a little positive, since I just said something negative: I’ve just been so touched by the response. I guess I haven’t seen anywhere but my hospital, but at my hospital, the nurses, the social workers, the physicians, the residents, everybody was very honored to kind of be working during this time, because we all felt like this is the kind of story you tell your grandchildren. Again, this is what you dream about when you go into medicine, that you want to be able to make a difference. And I think no one who’s a doctor and practicing right now, I don’t think, can feel like we’re not contributing to helping people.

Kevin Pho: And my final question: Do you have a take-home message that you want to share with the KevinMD audience?

Jesica Herrick: Well, so I would change it now to “Wear an effing mask,” I guess. If I were going to change “Stay the F at home,” I would probably title it now, in the world with what’s going on, “Wear a nothing mask.” I think it’s that simple.

Kevin Pho: Fantastic. Jesica, thank you so much for your time and insight, and thanks again for being on the show.

Jesica Herrick: Thank you very much.

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